shadow walking

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 Dave 
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Týsköll wrote: Thu Apr 04, 2024 2:17 am
Remembering something that isn't real is creating at best, lying to yourself, or at worst: lying to others.
Far better to admit to creating rather than lie about remembering, imo.
To be abundantly clear - my words are in the context of a person finding out that the whole world, including their birth/family narratives are ultimately illusion, and still holding on to them as "real" (i.e having been experience by them) is not bad.

The example I used: the Matrix. None of Neo's backstory is REAL since he's in a computer program. However, him abandoning his family, friends, co-workers etc without a backward glance is not cool.

Similarly, in Buddhism, even the whole world, ALL of it, down to every particle is an illusion does not give one the right to disregard people as people. In my view, in my practice, none of this, even you, my mother, my father, my family, my friends is ultimately "REAL" - however, I know where I was born, who they were and who my family is, despite it being true that even on a cosmic and personal level what I know of their reality is actually ILLUSION.

I myself hold on to memories and acknowledge events that have no ultimate reality behind them - they're my personal narrative. My keyframe, etc. My life.

Maya, illusion, wandering in Samsara.... and my view of people, places and things is just that, illusion.

However, I know that "rice is rice" and "sand is sand" - and I know where I was born, etc.

Thus, even though finding out and believing, accepting and practicing the enlightenment regarding the illusionary nature of all people and events is paramount in my life. I do not neglect to acknowledge and seek to help family, friends and people I met, and will meet, to a better life... with that understanding. The understanding of illusion. Doing it right this very moment in this very message.

However.... what I was trying to convey is: Neo sucks. He had a family, friends and co-workers. Once he finds out he was in the Matrix he contacts none of them and makes no effort to tell a single person in the Matrix it's not real. None of them. Not the people on the streets, etc. He trades one illusion for another.

That's the context: even if one finds out their entire life is illusion, it's not reason enough to turn your back on them (i.e. the people you know) for being illusions. Bodhisattvas "wear the armor of the saints" for the "benefit of people, who, ultimately, are not real."

I aspire to that.

Nothing I said had anything to do with creating fiction, lies or getting others to believe them in their past, present or future. Or lying to self about things, etc Or lying about memories. Etc. etc etc IMO.

To me, you, me and everyone I've ever met, while on earth as humans, is living in Samsara. Illusion. That's the context. Having met people in illusion, inclduing family, etc, is not reason, for me, to not treat them as people, or, as something one has experienced.

I hope I've made myself clear, and, if it was already clear to you, and others, well... it still bears repeating. Forgive me if that's the case.

Anyhooo... I have compassion for the illusioned and hope one day they're dys-illusioned.

MY overall sense of this thread, and clearly I'm mistaken, was about people being able to alter their reality, their surroundings, and finding out they are capable of reality bending. My two cents was, and is, that if one finds out they can do that (alter reality), like Neo, etc, that they do NOT forget their illusory Matrix parents, family and friends.... and that they use this knowledge and power of theirs for the benefit of others - and especially sharing that ability and view with them for their OWN use and enlightenment.

Compassion for those wandering in Samsara, and, compassion for those who aren't.

~Dave
Consciousness only. Reality is non-dual, mind and reality are one.
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Týsköll wrote: Thu Apr 04, 2024 2:17 am
Dave wrote: Wed Apr 03, 2024 7:39 pm ... Key frame, or, personal narrative is essential. Recalling when, where and to whom you were born. ...

... Remembering even if it isn't ultimately real ...
Keyframe is just a convenient overlapping word used by that other guy that I referenced in describing the notable events in our lives that make up our "narrative". Which btw is a word I've come to loathe due to horrific retards overusing it.

Remembering something that isn't real is creating at best, lying to yourself, or at worst: lying to others.
Far better to admit to creating rather than lie about remembering, imo.

Worse than all of that though? Creating something and leading someone else to believe they have memory of it. Creating false persona in someone else. Making someone else's life a lie. Despicable.
I don't really understand what you're trying to say
It's lying to recognize something as illusion?
Something being an illusion doesn't give you an excuse to mistreat those around you.
But I could be completely misunderstanding
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Dave wrote: Thu Apr 04, 2024 4:26 pm
Týsköll wrote: Thu Apr 04, 2024 2:17 am
Remembering something that isn't real is creating at best, lying to yourself, or at worst: lying to others.
Far better to admit to creating rather than lie about remembering, imo.
To be abundantly clear - my words are in the context of a person finding out that the whole world, including their birth/family narratives are ultimately illusion, and still holding on to them as "real" (i.e having been experience by them) is not bad.

The example I used: the Matrix. None of Neo's backstory is REAL since he's in a computer program. However, him abandoning his family, friends, co-workers etc without a backward glance is not cool.

Similarly, in Buddhism, even the whole world, ALL of it, down to every particle is an illusion does not give one the right to disregard people as people. In my view, in my practice, none of this, even you, my mother, my father, my family, my friends is ultimately "REAL" - however, I know where I was born, who they were and who my family is, despite it being true that even on a cosmic and personal level what I know of their reality is actually ILLUSION.

I myself hold on to memories and acknowledge events that have no ultimate reality behind them - they're my personal narrative. My keyframe, etc. My life.

Maya, illusion, wandering in Samsara.... and my view of people, places and things is just that, illusion.

However, I know that "rice is rice" and "sand is sand" - and I know where I was born, etc.

Thus, even though finding out and believing, accepting and practicing the enlightenment regarding the illusionary nature of all people and events is paramount in my life. I do not neglect to acknowledge and seek to help family, friends and people I met, and will meet, to a better life... with that understanding. The understanding of illusion. Doing it right this very moment in this very message.

However.... what I was trying to convey is: Neo sucks. He had a family, friends and co-workers. Once he finds out he was in the Matrix he contacts none of them and makes no effort to tell a single person in the Matrix it's not real. None of them. Not the people on the streets, etc. He trades one illusion for another.

That's the context: even if one finds out their entire life is illusion, it's not reason enough to turn your back on them (i.e. the people you know) for being illusions. Bodhisattvas "wear the armor of the saints" for the "benefit of people, who, ultimately, are not real."

I aspire to that.

Nothing I said had anything to do with creating fiction, lies or getting others to believe them in their past, present or future. Or lying to self about things, etc Or lying about memories. Etc. etc etc IMO.

To me, you, me and everyone I've ever met, while on earth as humans, is living in Samsara. Illusion. That's the context. Having met people in illusion, inclduing family, etc, is not reason, for me, to not treat them as people, or, as something one has experienced.

I hope I've made myself clear, and, if it was already clear to you, and others, well... it still bears repeating. Forgive me if that's the case.

Anyhooo... I have compassion for the illusioned and hope one day they're dys-illusioned.

MY overall sense of this thread, and clearly I'm mistaken, was about people being able to alter their reality, their surroundings, and finding out they are capable of reality bending. My two cents was, and is, that if one finds out they can do that (alter reality), like Neo, etc, that they do NOT forget their illusory Matrix parents, family and friends.... and that they use this knowledge and power of theirs for the benefit of others - and especially sharing that ability and view with them for their OWN use and enlightenment.

Compassion for those wandering in Samsara, and, compassion for those who aren't.

~Dave
the word illusion is speed of horse newtonian culture language

now in our 21st century of non contact forces and faster than light velocity
the structure and function of reality is becoming explained differently
arising from unified field translation and pracrical explaination in implimentation of gravity control etc etc
this is what our internet is structured for

none of this was imaginable in speed of horse culture
which itself could never support the nototion of non contact forces and faster than light travel because of obvious reason of slowness

in the latter part of last century our machine learning technology identified all of our ancient manuscipts as paleocontact documents which is why disclosure is msm today and now enshrined in american law thus in our foreseable future 6 billion plus users of our internet will be shown disclosure and encouraged to join in
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"An illusion is a distortion of the senses, which can reveal how the mind normally organizes and interprets sensory stimulation. Although illusions distort the human perception of reality, they are generally shared by most people."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illusion

what is it saying
nothing
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Dave wrote: Thu Apr 04, 2024 4:26 pm
Týsköll wrote: Thu Apr 04, 2024 2:17 am
Remembering something that isn't real is creating at best, lying to yourself, or at worst: lying to others.
Far better to admit to creating rather than lie about remembering, imo.
Nothing I said had anything to do with creating fiction, lies or getting others to believe them in their past, present or future. Or lying to self about things, etc Or lying about memories. Etc. etc etc
Ok, thanks for the clarification.
There are definitely those that do "create" a past that never happened and whether or not they're benevolent or malevolent in their 'surface level intent' is irrelevant.
Come on, you should know. Of course I dare mock you.
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Caylus Ark wrote: Thu Apr 04, 2024 6:18 pm
Týsköll wrote: Thu Apr 04, 2024 2:17 am
Dave wrote: Wed Apr 03, 2024 7:39 pm ... Key frame, or, personal narrative is essential. Recalling when, where and to whom you were born. ...

... Remembering even if it isn't ultimately real ...
Keyframe is just a convenient overlapping word used by that other guy that I referenced in describing the notable events in our lives that make up our "narrative". Which btw is a word I've come to loathe due to horrific retards overusing it.

Remembering something that isn't real is creating at best, lying to yourself, or at worst: lying to others.
Far better to admit to creating rather than lie about remembering, imo.

Worse than all of that though? Creating something and leading someone else to believe they have memory of it. Creating false persona in someone else. Making someone else's life a lie. Despicable.
I don't really understand what you're trying to say
It's lying to recognize something as illusion?
Something being an illusion doesn't give you an excuse to mistreat those around you.
But I could be completely misunderstanding
No, no. It's lying to create a memory that didn't happen. Benevolent or malevolent in intent, it's deception and can cause all sorts of fuckery.

I plucked out that sentence of Dave's specifically because of how it sounded to me, which is why I used the ellipses to exclude the rest of his text.
I was only addressing that specific part, and, I got the clarification sought by addressing it which was that he didn't mean it in terms of creating false memory, rather, remembering what is perceived by him (or is, in Neo's case) illusion.
Come on, you should know. Of course I dare mock you.
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